Wednesday, January 16, 2008

The KORD Razz Tourney and a Hand Question

Friday night is the KORD, a Razz tourney that I am reunning at regular times. This months version is called SLB's Umbilical KORD named after last months winner. He put a bounty on his head for a buy-in if I remember right and there will be a random bounty placed on another player yet to be determined. The tourney takes place on Full Tilt on Friday the 18th at 9:00 central time with a buy-in of 7.70. It is a knockout tourney with $2 being the bounty on each player. The winner will also get a banner created in their honor placed on Brickin The Nutz so come one and all and enjoy the fun. The password is "pokere".

Last night was the Skills game and I had an interesting hand that I wanted to ask about. I had a solid chip stack at the time and was involved a questionable hand.

Full Tilt Poker Game #4876153316: Blogger Skill Series (35811771), Table 6 - 300/600 Ante 50 - Limit Razz - 23:18:59 ET - 2008/01/15
Seat 2: schlepp571 (4,304)
Seat 3: corron10 (1,994)
Seat 4: HighOnPoker (8,085)
Seat 5: colddish476 (4,532)
Seat 6: pokerenthusiast (4,388)
Seat 7: NumbBono (3,184)
Seat 8: MiamiDon (4,249)
schlepp571 antes 50
corron10 antes 50
HighOnPoker antes 50
colddish476 antes 50
pokerenthusiast antes 50
NumbBono antes 50
MiamiDon antes 50
*** 3RD STREET ***
Dealt to schlepp571 [Ks]
Dealt to corron10 [Qs]
Dealt to HighOnPoker [3c]
Dealt to colddish476 [6h]
Dealt to pokerenthusiast [2d Ad] [7d]
Dealt to NumbBono [3d]
Dealt to MiamiDon [Ac]
schlepp571 is high with [Ks]
schlepp571 brings in for 100
corron10 folds
HighOnPoker completes it to 300
colddish476 folds
pokerenthusiast calls 300
NumbBono folds
MiamiDon calls 300
schlepp571 folds

I will always make this call.

*** 4TH STREET ***
Dealt to HighOnPoker [3c] [2c]
Dealt to pokerenthusiast [2d Ad 7d] [8h]
Dealt to MiamiDon [Ac] [Th]
HighOnPoker bets 300
pokerenthusiast has 15 seconds left to act
pokerenthusiast calls 300
MiamiDon calls 300

I took my time making this call. This player has shown the ability to play aggressive with high cards back so I float a bet. Should I have raised to try and push the T out?

*** 5TH STREET ***
Dealt to HighOnPoker [3c 2c] [8s]
Dealt to pokerenthusiast [2d Ad 7d 8h] [3h]
Dealt to MiamiDon [Ac Th] [3s]
HighOnPoker bets 600
pokerenthusiast calls 600
MiamiDon raises to 1,200
HighOnPoker has 15 seconds left to act
HighOnPoker calls 600
pokerenthusiast has 15 seconds left to act
pokerenthusiast folds

This was my quandry. I actually think that I'm ahead here. I know I'm ahead of the ten but he has a nut type draw. I also think that I'm ahead of the player with the 8. I took my time calling the first bet but when the other player reraised I may have made a mistake by folding. My mistake could have been calling the original bet. I'm not sure on this except that I wavered and folded with Probably the best hand but a lesser draw.

*** 6TH STREET ***
Dealt to HighOnPoker [3c 2c 8s] [7s]
Dealt to MiamiDon [Ac Th 3s] [As]
HighOnPoker bets 600
MiamiDon calls 600
*** 7TH STREET ***
HighOnPoker has 15 seconds left to act
HighOnPoker checks
MiamiDon checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
HighOnPoker shows [Js 4s 3c 2c 8s 7s 2s] 8,7,4,3,2
MiamiDon mucks
HighOnPoker wins the pot (6,450) with 8,7,4,3,2
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 6,450 | Rake 0
Seat 2: schlepp571 folded on 3rd St.
Seat 3: corron10 folded on 3rd St.
Seat 4: HighOnPoker showed [Js 4s 3c 2c 8s 7s 2s] and won (6,450) with 8,7,4,3,2
Seat 5: colddish476 folded on 3rd St.
Seat 6: pokerenthusiast folded on 5th St.
Seat 7: NumbBono folded on 3rd St.
Seat 8: MiamiDon mucked [5c 4d Ac Th 3s As 4c] - T,5,4,3,A

Who knows if my hand would have held up but it might have been time to go with it.


TheRazzDoctor said...

Hey guys,

Great blog you've got here, especially since it's dedicated to my favorite game. There seem to be a lot of players really getting into razz now, and having a place to discuss it and share beats/brags with your friends makes it even more fun. Good luck to all of you and your readers in your upcoming tourney.

As for the hand you posted, I would say folding 5th is a mistake. It's only one more bet back to you, and it's possible you have the best hand right now if the original raiser paired his 2. Go to the pro poker tools site ( and run an equity sim in their razz simulator to see where you stood. Multiway pots can be very tricky to play, but in loose games it's an important skill to develop.

Stay smooth,

Doctor Razz

MEMPHIS00 said...


I think you made a good decision by folding on 5th. Your made 8 low is a dog to the nut draw on 5th. I always like to get my money in with the best hand, and when I'm behind, I play to live another day (hand). You may have won this particular hand had you stayed in, but in the long run, it's a good decision.


HighOnPoker said...

I can offer my insight from my viewpoint in the hand.

I start off with 24/3. FT mixes up the cards after showdown, but trust me...I did NOT start with the Jack. It was my river.

Obviously, I start out raising with a 4-low. You and Don call and we see the next card.

With 24/32, my 32 looks scary and I hope to exploit that. Don has a Ten, so I figure he is probably willing to give up on the hand, since he merely called "preflop". I figured that your 87 was a handicap too. So, I bet out and you both call. Pretty straightforward.

My next card is an 8, for 24/328. I'm drawing to a good 8-low (not great), but Don has a Ten-low. You are my only real concern with 873 giving you a possibly strong 7 draw, but since you were so passive AND since it appeared like I had your 8-low beat based on the board, I bet out again, hoping that (a) perhaps you paired up, or (b) your starting hand wasn't that strong anyway. I am also happy to just push out Don and see one more card with you. When Don raises, I feel committed to a call. At the very least, I know I am in great shape if he bricks next.

Here, I think you probably should have called. Still, why do you think you were ahead of me? I know you have the info now, but what then made you think that 87 was in the lead. Here is where I strongly disagree with your analysis. Did you just assume that I had paired one of my hole cards? That's the only thing that makes sense. Perhaps my flat call of Don's raise could be a tipoff, but its also a smart move to make if I had a monster and wanted more players in the pot.

Once you fold, I get a sweet card and Don pairs, and the rest is acadmeic.

So, the long and short of it is that you probably should've called. You were very short, too, with less than 10x the BB, so if I were you, I would've considered that hand my last stand once I made the 87-low and hope for the best.

HighOnPoker said...
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HighOnPoker said...
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The Poker Enthusiast said...

I figured you paired the hand. I knew you still had a good draw that could beat my 8 and I had a draw to improve to a 7. With don re-raising to a nut draw and the chance that tou could already have a better made 8 I folded. I almost folded anyway before his reraise. I prolly had odds to call but I was much more vulnerable playing against two players so I thought that was the best move.